Commander Keen

Is it actually dated? yes these events took place over a century ago, but has changed? Sure we understand racism, sexism, homophobia and have strict laws which forbid/fronw upon these forms of discrimination. Should we have laws which govern/judge a persons lifestyle, or choice of lifestyle? Essentially thats what the RAVE act is doing; it's governing a form of lifestyle. Honestly if it ws only about the drugs then current drug laws would be sufficent.

As for drugs at raves, I would be stupid to say that it wasn't there, though I wouldn't go as far as to say that it was openly encouraged. I would also say that it would be unfair to force promoters to hire an unreasonable number of security guards or undercovers to harass partiers.

As for premarital sex/drinking, yes it is more prevelant in society.. whether the actual number of cases has increased is another question. Is it because of the openness that kids are drinking more and having more sex, or is it because of the openess that people feel as though they can talk about it without fear of prosecution?

Are drugs a problem? I don't know.. I could see how it could be a problem, but I can also see benefits from drugs, or at the very least, people who can use drugs responsibly. What I can say is that the current criminalization of drugs approach is not working at all and just say no simply does not work.

16 years at raves.. yeah that bothers me a lot too. An all night party is not a place for someone of that age. Shit when I was 16 I was sneaking out to have a smoke and possibly a few drinks at my friends place when their folks weren't home

Troile

Of course its your opinion xRaverx.

I never said it wasn't...and this is an internet message board...expect to have any amount of yahoos get upset by any opinion you might express.

So you're around drugs a lot...doesn't change your opinion.

I think your opinion is horrible.

So you accept drug use and don't condemn it...but you don't respect it. You've got to give respect.

Sorry man...but thats how I feel.

Don't get too upset by it.

Dave

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Polina

that is NOT at all fair.

oh yeah sure it bugs the shit out of me, in an extremly hypocritical way, but if to compare what you were like at 16 to what 16 year olds are like now.. times are changing, JUST like maybe 60 years ago it was inapropriate for 16 year olds (guy/gurl) to hold hands. And Rob was saying how it bothers him when he sees 16 year olds fucked up, and from what you said it seems like you automatically assumed that all these 16 year olds are fucked up. Thats completely stereotypical.

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If you can imagine it, you can create it. If you can believe it, you can become it

Peace cannot be kept by force. It can only be achieved by understanding.

Commander Keen

is it unfair though?

Again this is only my opinion, but a lot of people feel the same way as I do. There simply has to be an age limit. Of course not all younger ravers are gonna act stupidly but the general concensus is that the younger you are, the more easily influenced you are.

Even if you are smart and stay out of trouble, I still think that 16 year olds are still a bit too young to be out all night for the simple fact that once you cross the line there is no turning back. I kind of see partying as a loss of innocence where you don't need to worry about drugs all that much.

Polina, even though you may be the exception to the rule, a lot of other 16 year olds aren't going to think the same way you do. They're going to go to a rave, take e for the first time, have an amazing time. Then they're going to go to school and brag about how sophsticated they are and how much drugs they did. A teacher is going to hear this and then shit is going to hit the fan.

Polina

i do understand your point..
i would say more

but i DONT want this to YET again become a debate over age

DynamicHalfDuo

In re: the drug legislation... remember my earlier point about America as a puritan based society (Europe tends to view us as a reactive, prudish society, despite our own cocky belief in our superior freedom...by "our," of course, I'm referring to the United States)... I was thinking today about an interesting double standard that persists in American law.

Roe v. Wade found that a woman has a CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTION of the right of complete control over her own body. No one can force her to do anything with her body that she doesn't wish (the example cited in this case was abortion, which is a seperate topic and irrelevant to the point I am making). Now, I find it interesting that in the abortion situation - by all counts much more highly charged emotionally and physically than drug use - a woman has an absolute right to do what she will with her body...but that right does NOT extend to taking recreational drugs.

Again, as I said, her right of body is inviolate, according to the CONSTITUTION as interpreted by the judge in this case... but the right does NOT extend to drugs. Why the double standard? Just something to get you thinking....

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Troile

Hmmm raves and 16 year olds.

Meh. Seeing as how I'm everyone's bitch when it comes to getting rides...it was no suprise that I've started bringing people up to raves that I don't even know.

So I brought up 2 16 year olds to the last PoD. All I knew is that they went to school with one of my buddies...Meh. They were great fun to party with. They're still great to party with and great people. Thats about all my take on it...I really don't care that they're 16. Sorry.

I totally understand your point about 'losing your innocence'. But on the other hand...it can be a great thing. For some people raving just fits into exactly what they want to be doing. They might be miserable b/c they haven't found what they like...or haven't found any music they can dance to. Meh.

With the complications of highschool and a lack of money it can of course be a horrible thing. Of course just about anything can be a horrible thing. Regardless its a part of their life and shapes who they are.

Its an experience. I think becoming less ignorant is never a bad thing...at times can be overwhelming but ultimately it builds character. Thats why you should never regret anything you've done and...

"what doesn't kill me only makes me stronger"

RoB-B

But for some people, a fair share of people, drugs makes the rave.

Someone goes for their first time, takes an E, has a blaste.
Goes a second time sober and bitches the whole night that they want to go.
And some people dont go to raves unless they have extra money for drugs.

IDance, suppost to be celegrating that we can party sober, do you know how many people were high? A fair share.

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DynamicHalfDuo

I completely agree with every single word you just said. Booyah

xRaVeRx

Troile (i think) my views are good...but i guess your views are good to! so ya..if u think my views are horrible..well thats jus wonderful...!! i dunt realli care! thats how i feel..and sorry if you dunt agree!! (No Offense)...i dunt wanna make enemies (jus friends) ...

xRaVeRx

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-----{}- They call me, Ri.N.P -{}-----

Polina

^^^Hmmm i think i need to comment on your post

Just because you argue with someone does not mean that they will become your enemy. I think that useful argument is healthy in any friend ship or relationship.

if you are going to disagree with someone atleast state your points instead of just repeating that this is your opinion, otherwise its very easy for someone to take advantage of that arguement.

RoB-B

^^^ i agree

cause polina is da shit
thats my argument

xRaVeRx

w/e FINE!! --then everyone else is right!!

xRaVeRx

ALL I SAID WAS!! ( AND IM NOW SORRY I EVEN GAVE IN MY INPUT)
ALL I F*CKIN SAID WAS THAT --I THINK DRUGS ARE A WASTE OF TIME! AND A WASTE OF MONEY!! --thats it!!
so why this little comment has become such a big deal is beyond me! thas jus mah little tiny thought!
so next time i jus wont sya my input!! f*ck man..

xRaVeRx

xRaVeRx

ok...my anger is now gone...SORRY SORRY!!!
i get your point Polina!! *sigh* im in a bad mood cuz of everything in this damn house!! sorry, sorry!!

xRaVeRx

Troile

Awww...I'm sorry.

Don't be stressed out.

I suggest d/l some new music to help you relax. Or maybe a long shower? Definately a long night's sleep. That will put a temporary cure on anything.

DynamicHalfDuo

A long hot shower can cure ANYTHING. Take some happenin music in there to sing along with and dance too, and just stay in for like 40 minutes... ahhh... I usually take like 2 minute showers (army habit) but sometimes I just stay in until I can't wrench any more hot water out of the system....

RoB-B

masterbate

DO IT

Commander Keen

^^^

hehe masturbation is great.. it clears out your system if you're "backed up"

Polina

wow how thread topics change

from the rave act, to organizations, to drugs, to age, to masterbation?
ahh hullaboard I love you

Troile

next topic: orgies.

Raves always come back to orgies. Its a given.

RaverPrincess

Yeah I think this thread has disintegrated now....ah well - on to the orgies!!!

Nadine

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Work like you don't need the money.
Love like you've never been hurt.
Dance like nobody's watching.

Polina

i think that if you are gonna have an orgie, you ahve to do it right

dont you all agree...

xRaVeRx

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, I WUZ ACTUALLY SITTIN HERE LAUGHING BY MYSELF!! Holy..i needed that!! Thanx RoB-B!!
That made my day!! --thats how boring my life is right now
But at least im not werkin 2dae

xRaVeRx